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  • need advice

    I just completed my first IVF after 10 failed early pregnancies conceived naturally. Two were confirmed chromosonal abnormalities, others were mostly chemical pg. I'm secondary infertility, no problems conceiving my only son at 34. Trying to decide now about donor egg.

    I turned 40 this month. FSH was 18 or 20 last year, AMH 0.1. TSH was 4.2 this cycle (T3 & T4 normal, so not treated), & hubby's sperm sample came back 117 mill, 82% motile, but only 2% normal morphology for this cycle. This was a huge surprise! Previous sperm analysis had been fine, not sure how this 2% happened or if it's been a factor in my miscarriages all along.

    I did estrogen in the luteal phase prior to stims, 2 weeks of estrace 2mg TV. On CD3, my LH came back 9.8, E2 was 20. I started ganirelix the that day to suppress LH & continued for all stim days. I stimmed 225 IU follistim 2x/day for exactly 10 days & E2 levels did what they were supposed to. Started with 7 follicles at 1st scan which dropped to 4 by the end. On trigger day, 2 were in the early 20's & 2 were in the late teens. I did a final injection of 450 IU of follistim along with the ovidrel. At ER only 2 eggs were retrieved, apparently 2 follicles were empty. Both eggs were successully fertilized by ICSI, but by day 2 only 1 embryo was 4 celled. We transferred on day 2 & I did a second ovidrel that night. I continued prometrium 3x/day along w/ estrace, both TV.

    I've been pg many times & have always known the signs. I had mild cramping about 4-5 days after transfer & at that point started feeling mild nausea & other symptoms that I've felt previous times. About 6 days later I had massive cramping & those symptoms abruptly faded. My beta was 4 days later, negative.

    What are your thoughts about my protocol, response, & overall situation? Thanks in advance for your time.

  • #2
    Hi,

    Sorry to hear about your losses - I hope you and your husband underwent a thorough, comprehensive/intensive workup for RPL.

    Age is a factor in pregnancy loss. Your FSH was high, and your AMH was low. I'm assuming you're in a country other than the U.S., as your stimulation regimen is nothing similar to standard stim regimens we use here in the U.S. Starting Ganirelix PRIOR to stimulating with Follistim is a potential disaster for someone aged 40 and with FSH/AMH numbers signifiying diminshed ovarian reserve. If you are in the U.S., are you sure you're seeing a board certified RE???

    Egg quality can certainly be a factor in getting and staying pregnant, but I'm sure you know that.

    Hope this helps,
    Dr. Roseff in Florida (have you seen OUR world-renowned IVF success rates?!)
    Dr. Roseff - South Florida Institute for Reproductive Medicine - Boca Raton, FL
    PERSONALIZED/SUCCESSFUL Specialty care....

    Comment


    • #3
      Well I certainly feel like I'm stuck on another planet at times during this process, but no, I am right here in the U.S.A! Yes, he's board certified & I believe every test possible had been done for RPL (aside from the current numbers from sperm sample for this cycle).

      Just to clarify, I started the ganirelix on the same day as the follistim, not before. It was considered an antagonist protocol, but he didn't like that my LH was high that early. Can you elaborate the "disastrous" part? How could that have negatively affected egg development in my case?

      Comment


      • #4
        Hi,

        Ganirelix suppresses LH, but experience shows that when it's started "too early in a stimulation cycle" (before follicles have had a chance to grow to a fair size) it can potentially hinder follicle growth. If follicles are "held back" by the ganirelix, and if they don't grow enough, the cycle can result in "disasters" such as cancellation due to poor stim or fewer mature follicles (eggs) for retrieval.

        Since women of advanced reproductive age (over 35) and/or women with high day 3 FSH levels (>10) or low AMH levels tend to have fewer eggs to retrieve as it is, I would not want to start ganirelix "too early" in this type of patient....

        I hope this makes sense,
        Dr. Roseff
        Dr. Roseff - South Florida Institute for Reproductive Medicine - Boca Raton, FL
        PERSONALIZED/SUCCESSFUL Specialty care....

        Comment


        • #5
          It does make sense. Thank you again for responding.

          Comment


          • #6
            You're welcome!

            Dr. Roseff in Florida
            Dr. Roseff - South Florida Institute for Reproductive Medicine - Boca Raton, FL
            PERSONALIZED/SUCCESSFUL Specialty care....

            Comment


            • #7
              New and confussed

              Hi, I'm new to (posting) to the site. I've been here several times and read a lot of the posts, but just curious of anyone that has recieved the scholorship and had a successful pregnancy. what was your experiencel ike?

              Comment


              • #8
                need advice/update

                So I got the call today from my clinic's team meeting where they review cycles & make changes. I'm sure it took all of 2 minutes to make their recommendation for me which is to use a donor egg.

                I know my fsh is high & amh low. I didn't produce an outstanding number of eggs, but the ones I got did fertilize.

                Do agree with this based on my previous protocol description? Is it not worth another shot w/ a modified protocol? thanks

                Comment


                • #9
                  The only way I can scientifically/medically/appropriately answer your question would be following a history, physical exam, and complete review of ALL records and test results to date. If this is something you're interested in doing here (as a "second opinion"), please let me know.

                  All my best, always,
                  Dr. Roseff
                  Dr. Roseff - South Florida Institute for Reproductive Medicine - Boca Raton, FL
                  PERSONALIZED/SUCCESSFUL Specialty care....

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Thank you. I am going to request a copy of my file. Unfortunately we don't live in sunny Florida & our next move is a rather big decision for us financially & emotionally. There are many possibilities to consider & it's a bit overwhelming.

                    In the meantime, can you share any tips on things to look for in a trust-worthy egg donor program? The agencies scare me & I don't like another middle-man in the whole process.

                    Thanks again for responding.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Look for a program that has the HIGHEST success rate you can afford. Ask for the program's most recent success rate. I also have a bias towards programs with one doctor managing your cycle, smaller programs, that give individualized care (rather than large, "take a number" type, "zoo-like" practices).

                      As an aside, patients cycle here from afar, as we are renowned for the way we treat our patients and our extremely high success rates....

                      Hope this helps,
                      Dr. Roseff
                      Dr. Roseff - South Florida Institute for Reproductive Medicine - Boca Raton, FL
                      PERSONALIZED/SUCCESSFUL Specialty care....

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Dr. Roseff,

                        Your success rates look great! Does your clinic report to SART or CDC? How can I get more info about your donor program? Would you do a review of my case/file without a physical exam? thanks,

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Hi,

                          Thanks for your nice compliment! We collaborate with Palmetto Fertility (everything is done at my facility except the actual egg retrieval and embryo transfer, which are done there). Therefore, Palmetto reports to CDC/SART. Unfortunately, those stats are old and don't reflect our most current success rates. Also, the success rates I posted on my website are for my patients alone and NOT for those under the care of Palmetto Fertility (and that can make a difference).

                          What type of info are you looking for regarding our donor program?

                          I would do a case review without a physical exam, though sometimes we find things during the exam that can be very pertinent regarding success rates (such as an enlarged thyroid, breast mass, and obesity, for example).

                          Dr. Roseff
                          Dr. Roseff - South Florida Institute for Reproductive Medicine - Boca Raton, FL
                          PERSONALIZED/SUCCESSFUL Specialty care....

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Dr. Roseff,

                            Thanks for clarifying that... are you the one who does the ER & ET's though?

                            I would want to know how you screen your donors for one thing. Do you have a person who coordinates that & makes the final call on who becomes a donor? Is it completely anonymous? The cost of the donor cycle would of course be another factor (aside from the v. good success rates).

                            As far as the physical exam goes, I can see how that would be an important part of your assessment. My RE started with an hsg & bloodwork. All decisions have come from that. I had a baseline mamogram last year, keep up on my annual paps, have never had a weight problem, but my TSH is elevated (4.2 to 4.6) although neither of my RE's felt this was a problem.

                            It's your call on how comfortable you are with a consult that is not face to face. Thanks again for the info.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Hi again,

                              There are two board certified RE's at the center where the ER's and ET's are done, and they are the ones who are expert at these procedures and do them on my patients.

                              We screen our donors in accordance with national guidelines set forth by ASRM and SART and CDC. I have two staff members who coordinate donor recruitment - Dawn and Susan - though nothing is done without my knowledge and approval. Once a donor has met our preliminary screening criteria, her profile and baby photos are entered into our donor book. Either we can match you to a donor or you can look through the book and choose a donor. The donors are anonymous. We are extremely strict on who we choose as an egg donor. Our donor egg cycle fees are in line with most centers, and we discuss the fees during the new patient consultation.

                              My personal opinion is that a TSH in the 4's is abnormal (in accordance with the criteria set forth by the AACE in 2000 or 2001). I'm fine with rendering a second opinion without a physical examination as long as you know there's a small chance that something may have been found during the exam that can change what we do. If you want to proceed with a second opinion consultation from afar, please feel free to let me know....

                              I hope this helps,
                              Dr. Roseff
                              Dr. Roseff - South Florida Institute for Reproductive Medicine - Boca Raton, FL
                              PERSONALIZED/SUCCESSFUL Specialty care....

                              Comment

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